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Apple laptops vs. PC laptops?
This thread belongs to weasel.forumgeeks.net


2009-09-10 23:17 GMT   |   #1
 
Hello all. I would like some feedback on this.

I have seen so many comparisons about a Mac Book Pro and non-Apple laptops.

It would seem to me that IF you did configure a Windows based laptop with everything a Mac Book Pro has the Windows based laptop is a little less expensive.

My view on this is that with a non-Apple laptop you have greater choice. You don't need to buy a Cadillac when all you need is a Chevrolet.

Yes I can spend $3000 on a non-Apple laptop if I need that level of ability or I can spend $700 for a more basic machine. I have the choice.

Also the myth that Apple users are some how smarter than Windows users. I think the average Apple user is just as dumb as the average PC user.
2009-09-11 01:15 GMT   |   #2

My decision is purely economical:

-I need laptops for my business.
-I can use Linux for almost everything I do.
-I also need to run a few Windows applications in my work (no choice there).

So there isn't much choice for me. I buy refurbished Dell laptops. They do what I need them to do, and do it just fine. And so far, I haven't paid more than $450 for one.
2009-09-11 01:39 GMT   |   #3
 
PC Laptops are significantly cheaper and more powerful. Being susceptible to some viruses is such a small trade off considering what you get. Laptop I got for school cost about $1700 a year ago, it has 4 gigs of ram, 2.5 ghz core 2 dou, Nvidia GeForce 8600, I can play games on it, it allows me code, and I can run my linux boxes any network known to man, and some known only to monkeys (I invested in the good network adapter).

Don't get me wrong, however, I have used some nice Macs, and I like them, they make excellent machines for video work, video processing, and other multimedia creation. I have been working with Macs just about the same amount of time I have been working with windows systems (Linux comes in late in the game, as I have only been working with it for the last two years). I just can't see myself buying a Mac book or something of that nature, they really tend to emphasize sex appeal more then computing power.

Now, allow me to do some minor trolling:
Some people like macs because they have "toys" on there. You know what I am talking about, 99% of all programs beginning with an "i" is a toy on a Mac. Its like Baby's First Computer. ^_^
[/troll]

mossrisjhons wrote:Also the myth that Apple users are some how smarter than Windows users. I think the average Apple user is just as dumb as the average PC user.

I couldn't agree more. :)
2009-09-11 01:50 GMT   |   #4
 
mossrisjhons wrote:Hello all. I would like some feedback on this.
What feedback in particular are you looking for, which laptop platform people prefer?
# Survey-topics
This forum is for discussion, not for your personal surveys and polls. "Do you have a cat?!?!!!"!, "What's your favourite html editor???" and similar topics are not allowed, unless your own contribution contains at least some reasoning.
2009-09-11 05:02 GMT   |   #5

narqelion wrote:
mossrisjhons wrote:Hello all. I would like some feedback on this.
What feedback in particular are you looking for, which laptop platform people prefer?
# Survey-topics
This forum is for discussion, not for your personal surveys and polls. "Do you have a cat?!?!!!"!, "What's your favourite html editor???" and similar topics are not allowed, unless your own contribution contains at least some reasoning.


I think we (the Moderators) can handle this. While I understand you are trying to help, most of the time such rule quoting causes more trouble than it causes. If you are concerned a topic is not appropriate, the proper course is to report it.

As for the topic itself, I would say the "contribution contains at least some reasoning." It's not just trying to get a single word answer.

But I digress. Carry on.
2009-09-11 06:05 GMT   |   #6

The advertised benefit to Macbooks vs. PC laptops is higher hardware quality. Unfortunately for Apple, this really isn't true any more. The majority of mid-range laptops are using identical hardware, in terms of brand and manufacturing process. Hynix or Kingston typically produce the memory memory who in turn contract out some of their modules to Samsung. Hitachi, Seagate, or Fujitsu hard drives. Recently, I've noticed Apple using more and more Fujitsu drives which, in my experience, has the highest failure rate of any of the brands. Occasionally you'll see a Western Digital drive in a Dell or an Apple. Phillips/Sony generally make the LCD screens.

In reality, what you are really paying a premium for with a Macbook is the license to use OS X.

All around, one's decision of which laptop they should buy comes down to which operating system they want to use.

- Adam
2009-09-11 14:17 GMT   |   #7

AdamR wrote:All around, one's decision of which laptop they should buy comes down to which operating system they want to use.


Not to mention, you can't run OS X (legally) on a computer other than a Mac. It violates the EULA, IIRC.
2009-09-11 15:43 GMT   |   #8

AdamR wrote:The advertised benefit to Macbooks vs. PC laptops is higher hardware quality. Unfortunately for Apple, this really isn't true any more. The majority of mid-range laptops are using identical hardware, in terms of brand and manufacturing process. Hynix or Kingston typically produce the memory memory who in turn contract out some of their modules to Samsung. Hitachi, Seagate, or Fujitsu hard drives. Recently, I've noticed Apple using more and more Fujitsu drives which, in my experience, has the highest failure rate of any of the brands. Occasionally you'll see a Western Digital drive in a Dell or an Apple. Phillips/Sony generally make the LCD screens.
You aren't the only one who has seen/heard of Fujitsu drives having the highest failure rate.

In reality, what you are really paying a premium for with a Macbook is the license to use OS X.
Personally, I think you are paying for the brand more than anything.

A bit of perspective. A 13" Macbook costs about the same as a similarly specced Dell/HP/Compaq 15-17" laptop.

A 15-17" Macbook Pro costs more than twice a similarly specced Dell/HP/Compaq 15-17" laptop. Both brand new.

I'm sorry, but less is more doesn't apply here. A 13" screen when I can get a 15-17" screen for roughly the same amount of money? Yeah, I don't think so.

And yes, I am an Apple user. I have an iPod touch and a Mac mini. But Apple needs to be slapped a bit so they realize that these prices need to be improved. As AdamR said, they are using the same, if not lesser materials as the HP/Compaq/Dell laptops.
2009-09-11 16:48 GMT   |   #9

Firstly, Macs are personal computers. If you are confused look here - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Personal_computer I'm not being pedantic because this is a seriously wrong misuse of the term and it creates confusion and frustration. I blame Apple for the misuse with their averts but it most likely appeared elsewhere first.

OSX is more powerful than Windows. SyntaxError90 who said Macs are less powerful is wrong, at least in relative terms. OSX is fast and robust. Windows isn't either. He also had the bad impression that Macs are only good for creating media and staring at. While they are good for those things, it doesn't mean they aren't brilliant for other things such as web browsing, email, writing documents, organising files and electronic devices, watching videos, viewing photos and listening to music. The iLife programs are very good. In relative terms, definitely. iMovie is far better than Windows Movie Maker. There is one toy however, the speech recognition. It's funny trying and failing to get my Mac to tell me a joke.

mossrisjhons wrote:It would seem to me that IF you did configure a Windows based laptop with everything a Mac Book Pro has the Windows based laptop is a little less expensive.


You can't install OSX, which makes a massive difference.

Macs are cheaper if you think about the life span. Divide the price by the time you can use it productively.

Mac users are usually less ignorant than Windows users. Many Windows users don't understand that they can use a better Operating System or they don't know how to use other Operating Systems because they aren't good with computers. I've gotten people who aren't very good with computers to use Ubuntu before, so the latter is a poor excuse.
2009-09-11 17:44 GMT   |   #10

god0fgod wrote:Firstly, Macs are personal computers. If you are confused look here - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Personal_computer I'm not being pedantic because this is a seriously wrong misuse of the term and it creates confusion and frustration. I blame Apple for the misuse with their averts but it most likely appeared elsewhere first.


The term "PC" has been identified with non-Apple, DOS/Windows machines ever since the early 80's. IBM can largely be credited with the usage of the term in the consumer, mainstream market.

OSX is more powerful than Windows. SyntaxError90 who said Macs are less powerful is wrong, at least in relative terms. OSX is fast and robust. Windows isn't either.


Define "powerful." Define "fast." ;)

He also never said Macs are less powerful. He was putting forth the fact that dollar for dollar, non-Apple hardware is more "powerful."

He also had the bad impression that Macs are only good for creating media and staring at. While they are good for those things, it doesn't mean they aren't brilliant for other things such as web browsing, email, writing documents, organising files and electronic devices, watching videos, viewing photos and listening to music. The iLife programs are very good. In relative terms, definitely. iMovie is far better than Windows Movie Maker.


iLife is not free. ;) That being said, for the price, it is a very decent media suite. Also, have you tried Windows Live Movie Maker? In terms of features, it's pretty close to what iMovie has to offer. Not as feature-filled, but close.

Also, let's go through the things you described one by one:

Web browsing: The same exact browsers with the same exact rendering engines are available on OS X and Windows.
Email: A lot of people use web based email, so this point is irrelevant for them. That being said, for those that use desktop clients, there are nearly identical applications for both OS X and Windows. Windows Live Mail -> Mail. And to be honest, Apple actually lacks here. A lot of people use Outlook. Entourage for the Mac is an utterly horrible program. Luckily the 2010 version should see some significant improvements.
Writing Documents: OpenOffice.org is available for both platforms. Microsoft Office is available for both Platforms. Apple offers iWork which gets the job done, but is not as feature-filled as the full Microsoft Office suite.
Organizing files and electronic devices: I'm not exactly sure what you're referring to here, but this may come down to personal preference. At least, the files portion does. Whether you prefer the Finder or Windows Explorer all comes down to your needs. I can't tell you the last time I actually opened an Explorer window. Everything I do is done from the Start search box. As for electronic devices, from Vista forward, it has been an absolute dream in Windows. Again, a portion of this is personal preference, but the ability to work with electronic devices is easy on both platforms.
Watching Videos: Again, identical programs are on both platforms. VLC, iTunes, QuickTime. Windows has Windows Media Player which, with WMP12, has improved enough to become my primary media application.
Viewing Photos: This largely comes down to a personal preference between Finder and Explorer. For Windows Live Photo Gallery and iPhoto, there are alternatives such as Google's Picasa. I personally use Adobe Bridge.
Listening to Music: See "Watching Videos."

For more advanced multimedia creation, absolutely no one uses iLife or the Windows Live suites. Adobe is king with still media. Final Cut Pro holds the majority of non-linear professional video editors, with Avid also a key player. Adobe and Avid both have identical products on both platforms.

Macs are cheaper if you think about the life span. Divide the price by the time you can use it productively.


I've seen more MacBooks faulty right out of the box than any other brand of laptop. Apple's quality control (especially on iPods) is utterly terrible. As I indicated above, the hardware is identical so the failure rate is also nearly identical (within normal standard deviation). Also, your definition of productive may or may not be the same as someone else's. There is absolutely nothing I need or want to do that I can't do perfectly efficient on a Windows machine.

Mac users are usually less ignorant than Windows users. Many Windows users don't understand that they can use a better Operating System or they don't know how to use other Operating Systems because they aren't good with computers. I've gotten people who aren't very good with computers to use Ubuntu before, so the latter is a poor excuse.


Again, you're arguing your point with subjective terms. "Better" can be viewed as subjective, and the term needs to be clarified in this context.

- Adam

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